221. Navigating Changes in Your Marriage

Transcript:

  Welcome to the Connected For Real podcast. I’m Rebbetzin Bat-Chen Grossman, a marriage coach for women in business. And my mission is to bring God’s presence into your life, into your marriage and into your business. Let’s get started.

And we are live. Welcome. Yes. Welcome everyone to the Connected for Real podcast. I’m Rebbetzin Bat-Chen Grossman. I’m a marriage coach for women in business, and my specialty is that intersection where you are trying to find balance and. It always feels like something is coming at the price of something else.

Yes. So that’s what we’re talking about. And today with me uh, Natasha, introduce yourself. Hi. I’m C. Natasha Richburg and I understand the intersection between marriage and business and children and life and issues and fun. Yes. Yes. I told Natasha like, if we’re not having fun, we’re not doing it right.

So this is gonna be a really fun episode. We landed on the topic of change because there’s so much that is affected by the change that you experience. We are going through changes just naturally in our bodies throughout the years, but also in our souls and our calling and the way that we interact with life, and that affects the people around us and mostly our husbands.

So let’s get into that. I like that subject. That’s my favorite subject ’cause I change so much every other week. I’m sorry. So yeah, tell us a little bit more about that. Yeah, see, I’m a mother of four and a wife of one and I teach school and I’m a life coach and I write books and I go out speaking.

Started to merge in one way. Self-sufficient. I got it all. I can be everybody’s everything. And now I don’t wanna be your everything. I just wanna be part of some things and some of the things, like I only got flowers when you were in trouble. I want flowers every week. And that changed. He is like, who are you?

And then I sometimes I wanted to be treated like a woman, and sometimes I wanna be treated like a girl. And he’s like, who are you? So I have to explain who I am in every new season so he doesn’t feel like he’s losing his mind, but I understand sometimes it really is me, you know? So I have to give him grace, God’s grace, and two years to get it right.

It takes some patience. It definitely does. It really does. So let’s talk about the specific changes you’ve gone through because you’ve done a lot of things. That’s right. Like I started out working full time, my husband and I, no children traveling to dc my career and understanding information technology to working my way in management.

He kind of did his thing. I did my thing. We did our things and then the babies came and it’s like we changed shifts. He went to night shift, I stayed on day shift. We kinda split responsibilities and it was all good. But what I found, I did a list. My list had like 50 things on it and his had like two. I showed him the list.

I thought he was gonna get mad. He took the list and started circling things he wanted to do. Now this happened about 40 years ago now maybe? Yeah, about 40 years ago. ’cause we going on 43 years and I said, Melvin, how come now? I asked him like 40 years later, how come you didn’t fuss that day? He said, ’cause I was embarrassed.

Hmm. I was like, I did something right. ’cause I didn’t fuss. I just gave him the list and he just took the list and now he’s the king of vacuuming. Wow. I do nothing. Nothing. I hate to vacuum. I do not wash clothes. He’s the king. He wash folds, puts away. ’cause I just so despised. That was on the list. And the other thing, once we got to the point of four children, I had no time because when I was home, I had the kids when he was home, I had the kids.

When we was home, I had the kids and I was like, hold up, homie. When’s your turn. Only when I’m out. And then I got one day a month just to go somewhere and just do me. That’s amazing. It really is it, and it really worked. But now we, we did me, we did us, we had COVID and I wanna get back to us. COVID been over and we still trying to find our way back to us.

It’s been over. I don’t even wear my mask every day. I still wear it sometimes though, but not every day like I used to. Hmm. So changes is really rough. When like my husband, he is like, I’m just a creature of habit. I said, but if you don’t change, you die. Mm-hmm. So to live, you gotta change. That took like seven years for him to catch on to that.

I would always say, if you don’t change, you’re going die. You gonna change, you don’t die. So he had to figure out, I got it. Still take two years. In what way did he change? Now is the type he could come home, sit down. Okay. Let’s say, say, when I first wrote my first book, right? So I probably wrote Christian books just for youth, for young adults.

Just those kind of books. He didn’t even read ’em About 10 to 15 years in the marriage, he started to read ’em. So when we go out. He sits at my book table. I don’t even have to sell ’em. He went from not reading them, not knowing them that he sells more than me. Hmm. So you see that’s a big change. What do you think caused that change?

I don’t know. I just think with him it was just becoming more of a us. Than just him and me. I think that was the biggest change, and he could feel when people would ask him, and he knew the answers about my books. Hmm. Yeah, I think it just, it, I think you had patience to just sort of let him pick it up when he’s ready.

Oh, yeah. Seeing it in his face. I didn’t even think about that. That could have been it too, because I just, if you don’t wanna do it, I’m going without you. If you wanna come, come on. And it got to the point that after a while he’ll say, I’ll come and then can you set up my table? I’ll set it up. Well, can you sit here while I go talk to somebody?

Okay. And then he would then. And so it kind of worked that way. But I didn’t make, I have the philosophy, if you don’t wanna do it, I don’t wanna make you right. And that’s hard because most women, and you know, most of the listeners are women, but I do have to say hi to all the men. It’s so nice to know that you’re all listening.

I, I have so many times been on buses or gone somewhere. Where the husband looks at his wife and says, you should really listen to her. She has some great stuff. And I’m like, you, you listen. And he is like, yeah. To every single one. So, hi, I’m so glad you’re here. What’s ironic is that I don’t work with men, so I am fine you listening, but I was really sorry I can’t help you, but really it’s because I don’t think men need.

The external help because like you said, if you leave them to just be on their own with any type of, you know, thing that matters to you, eventually they will be interested because they’re interested in you. So whatever road is going to lead them back to you is going to eventually be an interesting thing.

And I find that a lot. So what I started saying before is that a lot of women want to make their husbands a certain way because it needs to be this way. Or I was planning on having this type of husband, right? And I am, you know, really sorry to break it to you, but it doesn’t like that. It doesn’t. It doesn’t, you know, one of the things that I always say to my children, what I learned early on back in high school, if you don’t want me, I don’t want you more.

If you don’t wanna do it, I don’t want you to do it, but I’m going to do it. And one thing I’ve learned, ha ha ha, when I do it, I make it fun. Let me get my books together, let me pack my stuff up. I’m going to do, and just kind of like sing through it and make it fun. So you wanna come out and join the fun?

Come on. And that’s a real skill right there. It reminds me of that story of oh, what was his name? Huckleberry Finn. Mm. He has to paint the fence. Mm. And so. He’s like, you know, he takes it from a chore to something he’s really enjoying and he’s like, oh, this is so much fun. This is so much fun.

And his friends all wanna do if you’ll gimme a dollar, I’ll let you paint the fence, but only this part because I don’t want you to have too much fun. I wanna do most of it. And so he ends up getting all his friends to pay him to do his chore because he was able to do that. And it’s a real skill. It’s a real skill to be able to choose.

To enjoy something that other people would see as why would you wanna do this? Or boring. Right. Or annoying. You know, one of the things that really changed doing the dishes for me was when one of the women in the park said, what are you talking about? Washing dishes is like playing with water. Yeah.

It’s hydrotherapy. And I was, and I’m sitting there going.

You know what? On a hot day. Why would you not play with water? It’s so fun. Right? So, you know, I’m not into doing dishes, don’t get me wrong, but when I have to do it, I put on music or I’ll put on a podcast and I go all in. The kitchen ends up being so excitingly spotless because I just like decide, I said like, intentionality, that changes everything.

I think so. Absolutely. Absolutely. And one of the things with especially being in business. Having children and having a husband. You have to have that silver lining when it comes to it. What’s in it for me? Well, we get to have pizza after we leave or we get to, you know, whatever.

And try to bring that bubbly, bubbly with it. Yeah. I try to bring the bubbly, bubbly, oh, you know what you, you said something really powerful just now. Is you set it up with the things you want. You know, if pizza would make you happy at the end of the thing, then just announce we’re having pizza. You know, like I remember I was really in the mood for, for frozen yogurt, uhhuh, and my kids were, you know, it was like a really hot day, whatever.

I was like, if we get this, that, and the other dawn, we are going up for frozen yogurt. It was like my treat because I wanted the house clean, but everybody was in it and it was just so fun. Because suddenly there was a really good atmosphere. And another thing that comes up for me when you speak about this is that first time I, when I was in college, I had this, you know, really very sweet friend.

And we were very close during college ’cause we were, you know, both in the same boat type of thing. And. One day she came with her nails done I said, oh, your nails are so pretty. It’s so cute, you know, good color. And they looked really well done. So she says, yeah, I got a manicure special because I stopped watching tv.

And I was like, what? And she’s like, I took upon myself that I don’t wanna waste my time anymore. So I stopped watching TV and I said, if I could do it for a whole month, then I’ll get my nails done. Yeah. And just that thought of like. Oh, you can treat yourself like you can do that. That was such mind blowing at the time for me.

I did not know. You can give yourself permission to do that. Right, and it works really. The same way, like you’re saying, I have to do this thing with my books. I’m going to have to go open up a thing, set it up, do the whole thing. I’m doing it because I want to, but if I feel resentful to my husband that he’s not helping, or he doesn’t even know what my books are about, or he doesn’t care enough to like, you know, put the effort in, if all that resentment starts to bubble up, you’re not going to show up.

The energy you want to be showing up as and also the whole setup the whole day, it’s gonna be draining. Yes, that’s true. That’s true, that’s true. And then just making it a, instead of a me thing, A we thing, a me, a, we and that. And I, and I do that in the marriage. It’s we, we can’t be where we are. ’cause I know how I used to be Marilyn, but I wanna see some flowers up in this house.

At least once every other week. And don’t go to Walmart. Go do that. Look, I’m gonna tell you what to do. I’m going to get ’em myself if you don’t. But I prefer you pick, and I just will be quiet. Even if I hate it, just do it. Please. You know, I need it at this, this part. And so as things change, he is looking at me.

You know, another thing that’s changed. I used to know every answer to everything. I don’t know nothing anymore. I know nothing. Why? What we gonna eat tonight? I don’t know what you want to eat. I don’t know. Well, we’ll starve until you give me a idea. I might cook it and I don’t mind, but you gotta give a idea.

I don’t wanna know everything anymore. I used to wanna be everybody’s everything. I don’t wanna do that anymore. I don’t. It’s, it’s so beautiful because I was part of a course where they were talking about all the stages of womanhood and they were describing all the different organs and all the different lessons that we can learn from the organs and the way that they function.

It was really fascinating. It was like an eight week course. It was mind blowing how amazing our bodies are. But anyway, and what we could learn from it. And one of the things that you’re saying now is, is one of the bonuses that they sent in the email, like, watch this video. It’s about what we spoke about and it was exactly about that.

That like you change as a person and the things that excite you change and the things that you’re. Willing to do change just because you’ve had more experience. Your interests are now focusing more on the stage of life that you’re in. Mm-hmm. So you are in, you know, the wisdom stage where you’re like I already knew everything and I’ve done everything.

And now I get to be more picky. You know, I get to pick my head up and say like, oh, we can do this differently. Actually, yes. I call this the big W. I got big wisdom. Mm. Because now I turned 68 this year. Oh, congratulations. If my W is really big, it was little when I was 40, it was medium and fifties. It’s huge now.

Mm. And I just rocked my W all over the place. And my W knows that just because I changed don’t mean everything around me changes. Right. And I have to have patience for that. I do have to have patience. But one thing I wanted to say when the kids was little, this was when my W was littler.

I love the fact that I wanted my kids to read, but I didn’t want them to think it was an obligation. So what I would do is say, let’s go to the bookstore and see what’s on sale. Pick what you want. And I’ll let you have a book. Then we’ll go to the movies, then we’ll have fun. So they would go through just to satisfy me.

And one kid liked science, one liked, I don’t know, that AMI stuff. And one liked Shakespeare and I was like, hurry up. I used to make the, I was so like bored and tired, but they don’t know. I trick them. I trick them into loving to read and. I made them, if they wanted anything, they had to file a full brief proposal signed by all parties.

The first proposal that I got, they wanted to not have off brand tennis shoes. At least they wrote why they needed it, what it would cause, and what they would do to earn it. And they all for signed. That’s great. Yeah, because I used to make them read. I used to make, pretend, let me take you to the library.

I don’t know what I’m going to do. That’s so funny. Yeah. That’s so funny. You know, it’s so funny because you’re talking 40 years ago and, and I’m thinking like now kids, I’m not sure if they’re gonna be able to write a proposal. Definitely not by hand. They might go on chat, GPT and say, spit me up a proposal explaining why I should have, you know, brand.

Mm-hmm. And, but the grandchildren, I make them write, you wanna ask me something? You gotta write it. And I do not let them bring electronics in my house. Wow. Wow. Leave it in the car. I, I don’t let ’em, and they pile their little stuff up and put it in the car, not around me. That’s amazing. I love that.

I wish you could do that to me. Just like force all my kids to leave the phones outside. We’re like Phoneless house. But the problem is that I use the phone and my husband uses the phone for things that we actually have to be on call for. So it’s like not fair. I feel like it’s just not, you know, it feels out of alignment and out of integrity.

But on the other hand. I think that also tells me something about my use of the phone and how I, well, you know, you, you, you’re at a different stage than they are, and when they get to that stage, they can do it too. Yeah. Yeah. But I think just, you know, if you get to a point where you’re judging them for being on the phone too much, then you’re probably on the phone too much and I’m going to own that.

And say, yeah, probably so. So today it’s, you know, this is a fun day to start this challenge. I’m gonna see if I can put it away before they come home. Oh, that would be nice. Yeah, I’m just gonna be like phoneless during the afternoon. And you know, another thing I do, and then I could tell they’re gonna start to do it when I don’t see them at the end of the day, but maybe I went somewhere and they got home before me.

I would want them to write on a sticky pad, everything they have on and put it on a refrigerator. And so when I come in, if somebody say, well, I saw a kid that had on black pants in the green top and I look on the refrigerator, that’s not what they had on the day because I would know what they would have on, and that was my way of knowing what they have on and not seeing them, and it would make ’em right.

That’s cool. Anything to make ’em right. You know, I thought you were going to say like, what they have going on and we have a gigantic calendar. Oh yeah. On the side of our cabinet. And it’s so fun because. They have the concept of time from a very young age, they could say, here’s where we are.

Here’s when this thing is happening. Count the days. You know, put little notes of where they’re gonna be when, and even the young ones like it. You know, for me it’s crucial to know where the older ones are ’cause I need to know, but. You know, for the young ones, it’s really fun to be able to show them like, look, this is how much time passed, you know?

Yeah. Like mind blowing. Yes. And then the other thing with the Big W and life changes. My husband could cook one dish. I don’t even ask for that dish. Just stay outta my kitchen.

Hmm. You can clean up if you feel like it, but that’s it. Yep. So you don’t, okay. Nope. You know, before when we started you said that every marriage is unique. Yeah. And so the, the advice isn’t necessarily what to do, but more of like. Formula. Yeah, so let’s talk about that a little bit because this is a really great example of unique marriage situations where it’s like you’re two humans.

So already you have two unique people who have to work together and you can’t compare between couples. No, you cannot. So like one of the formulas, I really am strongly on intent. What is your intent? So when Melvin and I first decided to get married, we put a list down of things, what each one like to do.

And like, I love to cook, so I said, if you don’t cook, then you can help clean the kitchen. I mean, I’ll clean as I go, but you can at least do the dishes. And then I like to write the grocery list. You can do the shopping, but what I found with that, he gets exactly what’s on the list and if I leave something off, he don’t get it.

I said, you know, we didn’t have milk. He said he didn’t put it on the list. I’m like so and so that part of it, you know, really helped a lot. But one thing about our marriage, this is different than something if we have a disagreement, I have to give Melvin 48 hours before I can begin the subject. Hmm.

Especially in the beginning. In the beginning, it might’ve been 72 hours. Now that we kind of did the switch. We can even talk about it in 24 hours. And one time I called Guinness Book, we talked about it in less than four hours. Wow. That’s a response. So some people have to talk Right then. That doesn’t work for our marriage.

But the, the intent is to talk. I trust that he will talk and I wait till he’s ready. Mm-hmm. And I just have to get over myself. And some people wanna talk. Right now it’s the only way. It’s the only way. In our marriage I had to learn. He can’t do it. It’s not that I can’t, ’cause I can talk the second we go through it and work it out.

He don’t wanna do that. He just doesn’t. So I had to learn to back off. That’s amazing. For our marriage. Yeah. Yeah. I think that realizing that every marriage is unique. That the point of listening to podcasts and to being in this, you know, growth mindset is to hear ideas, to get inspired, to find what other people are doing, as, you know, just sort of like hints of what’s working out there in the world.

But bottom line, it has to work for you. Yes. And so, you know, I had here a guest. Yael Trusch and she talks about money, dates. Sit down and talk about your money and like open up all the bank accounts and have this whole conversation about what’s where and where’s what and what are our goals and whatever.

Really, like every single week, set a time and have a money date and I. Tried it a couple times, it doesn’t work for us. Mm-hmm. We like to walk and talk. We don’t wanna have a computers open. We don’t wanna feel like it’s so heavy. We just want to be outside. So we’re either going for a drive or we’re walking and we’re just letting the conversation flow.

And I found that just, you know, for us and our marriage and our. Communication style and whatever, what we built together in this unit, this works. So it doesn’t mean that money dates don’t work. No. It means that it’s just not our speed. It’s not the thing we need in order to do the thing we’re doing.

Right. But I think it’s really important to just give that space, you know, give yourself permission to do it your way. Right, because even when it comes to money, I didn’t even know till other people told me that we don’t do it like some couples do. So how we do it, we have one account that Melvin’s paycheck goes to and that does the mortgage and anything associated with that.

Then we have another account that I have my university checking and stuff go to that pays all the life. The life bills. And then from that we send money to savings. I do that and then we have an account that he can swipe and every day he ask me, I wanna get this. Do we have the money in there?

And I’ll make sure it’s in there. So we have the swipe account. Mm-hmm. So every day I have a sense on where all the accounts are, and he approves the use. So he’s the approval, I’m the doer. So everybody feels like they have their hands on it, but it’s no mine and his, and then this is funny. And then he said, and then I sent him an allowance for his own account that he do whatever he wanted.

I don’t care. He asked for a raise.

That’s funny. I said, okay, you can have a raise and that’s the, I don’t care what you do with it, I send you that money. And that’s just a hundred percent you Do you have that for yourself also money for you? Well, I can do what I want ’cause I control all the accounts. Ah. And so before I do anything though, I always run it by him.

Yeah. And that’s a, that’s why you see women like sneak bags in the house. ’cause they don’t want him to know. I’m like, I’m not sneaking no Melvin. I want some tennis. Okay. That’s it. Right? Melvin? Or, or I say, we need the kitchen done. I don’t want the kitchen done. We need the kitchen done. I don’t want the kitchen.

We need the kitchen though. Okay. And then he’s the foreman over it. So I’ll come up with the idea of what needs to be done. He’ll say he don’t wanna do it, then we eventually do it. Then he, then we negotiate the budget with the contractor and he’s the overseer. Nice. I like that. I like that part. ’cause I’m not the overseer.

No. Once the money part is settled, he done. Interesting. Mm-hmm. And I love that. I love that every couple has their, you know, their interactions, their, you know, one is stronger in one thing and the other one’s stronger in something else. And sometimes you just realize that you’re both not strong in something and you have to bring in help.

Right. It’s. It’s really an amazing ability to do, because then you’re freeing the other person from feeling bad that they’re not strong at this. Right, right. And the crazy thing is you don’t know who’s strong. ’cause I thought Melvin was stronger at money when we first got married, and he did too, and we learned he wasn’t.

I’m stronger. So I’m stronger at laying out the principles behind it. I just like him to have the approval. Then that’s the checking and the balance. Right. Right. And then I know all of the figures. I show him all the figures and he just wants to know the figures.

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  That’s really cool. So tell me about the, the recent change. What has been happening now that you’re, you know, transitioning into a new Yeah. The recent change is really hard for him to get used to the fact that I just don’t know everything and I don’t wanna know everything. Well, how’s what a kid is doing? I don’t know. Call him. Well, what’s such and such don’t, I don’t know, call him.

I, I used to always be the in-between. I don’t wanna be the in-between all the time anymore. Mm. That’s hard for him. He’s still adjusting. It’s going on two years now. It’s, it’s real hard. And I said one of the things in this marriage, I always knew everything and you were okay not really knowing anything.

And now having to know is difficult for him. Right. When I’m patient, he’s figuring out I’m good. I’m not going anywhere. But you going to know something. I don’t wanna do it anymore. Right? I don’t. So what do you do with all this extra time? I do not, girl, you see, I didn’t fill out the form. I did not have time.

I look at what I do, I don’t know how I do it. I really don’t. I don’t, it’s really a lot. As soon as we get all, Hey, I’m gonna go grade papers, then I’m gonna deal with clients and I’m getting ready. You know? I don’t know, but I know one thing. I don’t wanna know everything anymore. Right, right. Do you feel less stressed now that you let that go?

Yes, because then I don’t have to know. That’s one thing less in my brain. I try not to have to remember stuff. I try to write stuff down. I said I missed it. So I try to write stuff down more than having to hold it in my brain like I used to, that kind of thing. Yeah. So that takes away a level of stress.

It was stressful ’cause he didn’t understand. He heard me, but understand that I’m just not gonna know everything. Right. I like what you said, and I’m gonna double tap here because something really important that I think people should hear, and that is that we end up taking on a role of in between person.

Mm-hmm. You know, a lot of times it’s like my kids will scream at me when they’re upset at my husband because I’m supposed to be what? Like, why do you think I can control him? Just because I am his wife and just like that, I come to the room and my husband starts complaining about the kid because he’s being disrespectful, whatever.

I’m like, why do you think that I can control the child just because he’s my child and who put me in the middle of this? Right? So I just find it so comical that the natural. Role ends up just falling on the mother, being like, you be in between. And I recently told my husband, it’s your relationship to own.

You know, I’m gonna own my relationship with my kids differently than you’re gonna own your relationship with your kids. And you know, just looking back at my grandparents, when we would go to my grandparents’ house, we would go to my grandmother. Yeah. You know, like, okay, we’re going to grandma. And it’s like, wait, but grandpa’s there too, right?

That’s he’s there too. And we see him and we like him and we play with him. Yeah. Why is it called grandma’s house? Right? So it’s just those tiny little things that you pick up on and you realize, I think there’s something to this, you know? And this is sort of like how. Roles just sort of fall into place and things just happen like this and, and then you have the opportunity to get intentional and say, wait, I want it to be a different way.

So, like you said, it may take two years to teach everyone this new way. Yeah, that’s what I give it. I, it usually is about two years, so I don’t say, I don’t wanna do this anymore. And it happens. Right. I just have to say it again and it keeps saying it. Different ways, and I just don’t wanna be that person anymore.

You know, there’s when I, I was a graphic designer for 15 years before I pivoted to being a marriage coach and, you know, the pivot was really fascinating. I was pregnant with my number six. I. Was feeling called and I had to follow the calling and I was very uncomfortable. But anyway, when I finally started doing coaching, people were calling me for graphic design and.

I would tell ’em, I don’t do it anymore. Like, no, but just this one little thing. Like I don’t do it anymore, but it’s just this like time, it’s gonna take you a second. Like I don’t do it anymore. And for about two years, people were still referring people to me. People were saying, I heard from this person that you’re the best one.

I’m like, I know. I am the best one. And I’m really sorry to tell you that I didn’t do it anymore. And there’s many new people who are becoming best because there’s more room for them. I am being called to be over here right now, and it, it fascinated me how many years later people are still calling for something that I don’t do anymore.

For like what, you know, whatever it was now seven years, eight years, right. And like. Aren’t you a graphic designer? I’m like, no, I’m not. No. Oh no. And you do it with a smile. I’m just not that anymore. Right? And at this point in my life, I just wanna be celebrated and not tolerated. And if I see I’m in a space where I’m not celebrated, I just remove myself.

No goodbyes, I just remove myself. It sometimes it takes people six, seven months to realize I’m removed myself. Wow. Wow. And that says a lot because you’re, you know, the places where you’ve worked and where, you know, with all the IT and also the university and a lot of the things that you’ve told me about, you’re the only Oh, and so.

Only Richburg. And you know, sometimes I have to say one time I had a class of 110 students and a white male came at me. I said, boy, look at me. I’ve been the only at so many tables. I’ve been the only at this institution in this department for so long. You’re not gonna talk to me like that. So fix it. And I said, plus I’m short.

That just kind of lighten it a little bit and so I don’t take it personally, but people don’t know. That’s hard. Yeah, it’s hard. It’s really hard because it means that what, you know, what makes sense to everyone else is not as obvious. For you. Mm-hmm. And, and it takes a lot more energy to get there. So in that, you know, being, having that experience of being the only, the only woman, you know, the only colored person, the only whatever it is that, you know, the only short person in the room.

I’m kidding. What, what happens when you feel like I don’t actually wanna be here anymore? It usually is on a friend level, on a friend level, somebody who knows my heart, who knows my soul. It’s kind of like at this, the last two semesters in school, I’ve been saying, when you write, I wanna read your soul.

When I read ai, I know ai. I want an inventors or some of it, I don’t want that. It’s soulless writing and I can tell when there’s not a soul in it. So the only person you are fooling is yourself. So when they get me, they get my soul. Mm-hmm. They might not remember my name, but they remember my spirit because I love you enough to tell you the truth.

A lot of people don’t love you that much. Right. That’s love. That’s my soul. Yeah, that’s beautiful. Mic drop.

But it’s true. It’s true. I’m a big W now, so I’m at the point I speak my mind. That’s great. So let’s, let’s get some real, you know, practical advice. A woman’s listening, she’s overwhelmed. There’s a lot going on. She’s juggling a million things and she’s feeling resentful because she’s doing it all right.

So first thing I always tell people when they feel like that, write everything down. Let your list worry. So it’s taken out of your head and you just plaino write it down. That’s on day one, so the list. God will talk to your list. You go take a hot bubble bath. The next day. You can tell the bubble baths. I take one every night, and then the next day you come back and circle the things on your list.

Three things that have to be done in order. The rest, you let them stay there and let God worry for you. You don’t need to worry about it anymore. And you do the first thing first, the second thing, second the third thing. Third, when they’re done, go back to your list, circle three more things and bring them over and let God worry about ’em.

And you do ’em in order. Mm-hmm. And I always tell him, let the list worry. Get it out your head. ’cause everything that’s come to you to do is because it’s for you to do. Let your Big W work for you. Oh, everybody’s not a big W yet, but those of you with little and big Ws, let the list worry for and you just do one thing at a time and it’s going to be okay.

Wow.

Just writing the list feels like it’s going to be overwhelming. Well, that’s all right because once you write it, it’s outta your head and then close it and go take a bubble bath. Man, you’re making me get really in the mood for a bubble bath.

I mean, you’ll be surprised. And when you open the journal back up, that’s why I’m like, I got journals all over way. And you open the journal back up. And if you can’t look at the whole list, just cover the bottom and just do the top three things. Mm. And know it’s gonna be all right. It’s gonna be all right.

You gotta know it’s gonna be all right. Hmm. Yep. It’s going to, it’s going to be all right. I love that. I love that. This is great advice. What else? So what else If somebody’s overwhelmed. That gets you through being overwhelmed. Really put it in your, if you don’t have a journal, go buy a journal at the dollar store and put your stuff in a journal.

Close it and let God worry at first. Take your bubble bath after you write it. Okay? And then, and then you come back and pick three things. If you can’t look at it all, just cover the bottom and do the top three things. That’s it. You have to know it’s going to be all right. Then the next thing you have to do, what do you love?

Love, love, love, love to do. I love the crochet. I love to write. I love to go for a walk of the three things you love to do. If you love to paint your toenails, paint your toe nails, just do that. God is still working on your list. You already got three things. You don’t have no reason to be overwhelmed and you gotta put something that you love to do.

Yeah. In there and, and even if you love to hug a tree, that’s why I tell people, if your big thing is hug, go hug a tree. It don’t have to be deep. Right? Yeah. Last time we spoke, I love that you were talking about soul work. Versus, you know, there’s, there has to be room for something that lights you up. Talk about that a little bit because I think that you just hit on it and it’s so important for people to hear.

I always talk about in life and I tell my students this, all of you gotta pay your bills. So that might be head work, but you gotta have heart work. And if you love to draw, draw. If you love to paint, paint. If you love to eat, just eat low calorie, don’t eat lot high calories, you know, watch that. But you gotta have something that feeds your soul.

You gotta have something. I worked in information technology for 31 years in the federal government and it became heart work, but it started as head work and then I started taking that and teaching it. That became heart work and I teach it. Another heart work is being a life coach, but I’m not. I don’t take in all customers, I’m very petite, just a few customers at a time.

That’s it. And they gotta wanna do it, but it’s still heart work, right? So head work and heart work. If you don’t have both, you are gonna die in your head. That’s why you’re gonna feel overwhelmed. Mm. You’re saying people who are overwhelmed are not doing enough heart work? Yes. Which is a little bit counterintuitive because you think that you are overwhelmed.

You need to do more, but really, if you’re overwhelmed, you need to do less. Mm-hmm. If you are overwhelmed, it’s ’cause you’re not feeding your soul. You riding on empty. Heart works feeds your soul. Mm. So if you like the tutor that that tutoring will feed your soul and then you’ll go out and make that money.

You gotta feed your soul so you can work from your head. And sometimes hard work and head work are the same, right? But even in, you know, people say, okay, I’m gonna open up a business and it’s going to be heart work and it’s gonna be exactly what I wanna do. But every single heart work comes with head work and every single head work has the potential to have some parts of it be heart work.

Right. You know? So you have to get intentional and really look because you, it’s okay to have both, but you have to know what’s what. But just like go back with you being a graphics artist, what you did, you learned to work with people. You learn to think even though they say they want green, you know they really want blue.

You learn to read people’s soul. They say they want an animal, you know, they only want a pillow. And you know, and you start, and so what you were doing was head work that taught you how to do your heart work. And you said, I don’t need to do the graphics anymore ’cause I can work with bringing them together with the.

Business and the marriage because of your head work, it drove you to your heart work, and now your heart work is your head work. I see it. Oh, I love that. It’s so beautiful that you were able to pick that up. You know what was interesting, yesterday we had a networking event and three people showed like two people and me because you know, from nine people, everybody canceled.

We ended up with three, which was fine because we went deep and it was really great. So one lady sit. On one side of me, the other lease sits on the other side of me and we start introductions. So this one’s a graphic designer, this one’s a graphic designer. I used to be a graphic designer. So what makes us all different?

And we got so excited about finding the differences, and it turns out that this one likes to work with solopreneurs and she doesn’t want anybody else on the team because she wants to help this person find their soul and their colors and what excites them and whatever. Meanwhile, the other one is like if you don’t have at least three.

People working under you. I will not work with you because I only do companies and I only do things that actually matter, and I need to have like, you know, deadlines and just get it done. And she says most of her people who she works with are men because she just doesn’t like working with all like the, you know, mushy.

Emotional stuff and it was beautiful. And like they kept going ping ponging back and forth, like I would never work with that, you know? And it was so fascinating. And then they turned to me and said, what was your specialty? And I thought about it and I said, actually. It’s the family businesses. See, I was their graphic designer because I got to make peace.

I got to be in that room and let everybody be heard and find out who makes the decision at the end, and how do we get everybody on board and what needs to happen for you guys to like, you know, respect each other even though your siblings fighting over inheritance and whatever. Like everybody had their story and somehow they were all happy when I was there.

See, and I said, what happened to me? Yeah. So your head work gave you the business thing you needed to do your heart work. Yeah. Right. You know, one of my clients. You know, one of these families that I was working very closely with, he said to me, I don’t know what you’re doing here. You need to be doing, you know, coaching.

’cause I helped him through some like, real big issue and I said, no, I, I basically thought, you know, subconsciously, and it finally came to me after a couple years that. In order to be in this room, I needed to find an excuse. And graphic design was my excuse, right? But I got a little bit more w and I realized you get a little wiser and then you’re like, I don’t actually need to be a graphic designer to be here.

I could do this without, and I love it. I love it, babe. If, if you guys are in a business. And there is some sort of friction come to me, but really, you know, the specialty now is the women in business because I found that when a woman is pulled in the direction of doing her heart work right.

Then the home ends up feeling like head work. Yes. And then you wanna avoid it and you start to sort of neglect your family. Right. ’cause it feels so good to be out here and do the thing. And so really that’s really important. The type of work I do is finding that balance of like, how do you still stay excited about the things that you get to do as a mother and wife?

While still, you know, really growing your business and doing the thing you’re here to do. Right. And the good thing about what you do, which is meaningful, every person has a different fingerprint of what works for them. Right? So you can go to a book, but first you gotta know who you are, what makes you tick.

And that’s the beginning of knowing what may work. Yeah. Yeah. It is no one answer. So watching podcasts and everything is great, but you gotta put it into who you are, right? And what makes you tick. It’s so beautiful that you can pick that up so easily. You know, like, look at what I do. I’m you, I told you I’m a Big W.

It’s so fun. It’s so fun because I feel so seen. I’m like, yeah, you’re right. That’s why my program is a private coaching program is ’cause you get all of me and you get me in your situation, like nice and close so I can help you through all of it. And like, we detangle and we make things work, and suddenly you’re giving yourself permission to get a dryer because until now you’re just hanging your clothes or you give yourself permission to go out and, you know, do the thing you wanted to do all these years and you didn’t.

That really excites me. Excites me too. Yes. And, and the other thing with you being a former graphic artist, you see color right? So you can see the colors coming together and separating and bringing them together and blend. You naturally see colors. Right? Right. You know what’s funny? Even when I was young, my parents would make fun of me until this day that, you know, the, the ketchup is just past the red, the mustard past the yellow.

Yeah, that’s w working. I told you my family. Can you imagine what my family goes through? Can you imagine? And they say she can see stuff. I can. That w is awesome. Yeah, it’s so fun. So fun, so fun. Okay, Natasha, tell us, how can people find you? Where can they connect with you? How can they find your stuff?

Oh, C. Natasha Productions. That’s my website. Dot com Or just Google. C. Natasha Richburg hit me up. All my information’s out there. Nothing secret. Great. Any last words before we end? Oh, this was fun. Know who you are. Don’t let life overwhelm you. Get a journal, write it in the journal, and trust God will separate it for you so you can do first things first.

I love. Take a bubble bath. Take a bubble bath.

I love that. I love that. And hire a coach because Oh, yes it does. Yes. You could shortcut a lot of the noise and a lot of the drama when you have somebody who’s holding your hand. I’m so, I’m so used to being a coach. I don’t think to tell people to hire a coach, but yes, hire a coach. Yeah. Yeah. I just, everything you’ve said until this point, I think it just all makes it so clear, so clear.

You know Right. If you have a goal and you wanna get there, you make sure you have the right people on your side telling you how to, you know, get there, you know? Right. If somebody has done that journey before, you don’t need to invent the wheel. No. Don’t you really don’t, and no. Anything you wanna do, and I’m, I’m gonna let you go after this, but I had a client and I told him, you gonna get the four digits, man?

I could see it. We worked up a strategy. He and he kept saying, I don’t believe you. I said, just do what I say. Yeah, but he got there. Yeah. I said, I told you I know what I’m doing. Right. You know, I think that’s one of the things that a lot of people don’t talk about is you can borrow your coach’s confidence and.

Ride on that. Ride on? No. It’s like, I have no idea what I’m doing, but they think I can do it. And it’s really helpful because I have so much experience. I could tell someone, you’re gonna have an amazing marriage and you just need to let go of a couple of things and refocus and like, you know, make it work, but it’s gonna be awesome.

And they’re like, I don’t know, it hasn’t been for the last 20 years. I’m like, I don’t care. I’m telling you. And, and then they turn around after we work together. Like how did we do that? Yeah. I’m like, you just trusted. You join and you’re like, I’m all in. Do what, you know, tell me what to do. And that, that is such a good strategy.

So yeah, I, I appreciate that you said that, that was a good example. Ah, thank you so much for joining us. Thank you for listening. Don’t forget to be connected for real.

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